The latest happy S300 owner

[PeteH]

Well folks, I've finally got round to buying myself a NAD S300 integrated amp after talking about it for months and months (thanks again stumblin).

First impressions? Big, open, effortless sound, with a frightening dynamic range compared with my old Marantz 6010KI. Not a lot more by way of actual detail dug up (which is probably a tribute to the resolving power of the 6010KI, IMO highly impressive for a £400 amp), but seemingly more refined at the top end - results in a bit more perceived air and space in pop records, and (the biggie as far as I'm concerned) a much more convincingly natural timbre in orchestral music. I was a bit surprised by this - was expecting the big difference to be in low-end control, and while there are some gains there it's not as much of a difference as with the treble.

And f*** me it's big and heavy. :D Looks the absolute business though - it's got the kind of presence it's worth paying for even if it didn't make any noise. :)

Hopefully there's a picture somewhere if I haven't cocked it up somehow :confused:. Edit: Ah, there it is. :cool: Edited again: for spelling :rolleyes:

[I-S]

Hope you're happy with it.

BTW, if you want to get an even finish on the front panel, clean it with a v. mild detergent solution, then wipe down with GT85 or WD40.

[PeteH]

BTW, if you want to get an even finish on the front panel, clean it with a v. mild detergent solution, then wipe down with GT85 or WD40.

Cheers - although most of the grain is actually my ultra-rubbish camera (compounded by the effects of extra-robust compression as I wasn't sure how much space I had to play with).

[PeteH]

All you S300 owners out there: how's yours for humming, and can you do anything about it? This one hums at a mildly annoying kind of level - you'd notice it between tracks, although if you're listening at any kind of reasonable level it's comfortably drowned out even in the quiet bits (classical listener here).

[penance]

Pete,
Maybe a mains problem?

[wadia-miester]

Common mode problem Pete?,

[GrahamN]

...but seemingly more refined at the top end - results in a bit more perceived air and space in pop records, and (the biggie as far as I'm concerned) a much more convincingly natural timbre in orchestral music. I was a bit surprised by this - was expecting the big difference to be in low-end control, and while there are some gains there it's not as much of a difference as with the treble.
...
Interesting comments. I think that (at least for us classicos), improvements at the bottom end are quite simple: an adequate amount of power required but blistering speed is not really an issue as it's not relevent to "real" instruments, which take time to speak and die away. The big difference for us in a quality amp is, as you've noticed, the top end refinement, for getting the timbre and avoiding muddying up the sound in a reasonable sized orchestra.

As for the hum, you could try isolation transformers etc to see if a DC component to the supply is causing a problem, but it could just be the construction of the transformers. I have the same on mine, and while it was quite annoying to start with, you get used to it and your perception of it goes away (until you actually switch the amp off, when you realise what was there all along). The biggest problem is of course in low volume pieces (to which I do listen quite a bit, even if that would shock W-M) - e.g. some Morton Feldman stuff, a few string quartets, and of course the end of Beethoven Op 111 :( .

[bart]

Pete, don't you get an impression that the top end is slightly muted with S300? I auditioned it twice, every time with different set of speakers and the strings seemed a little less bright and lively than with other amps (I'm also a "classical guy").

[PeteH]

Pete, don't you get an impression that the top end is slightly muted with S300?

I was sort of wondering that actually - I was getting the impression it was ever-so-slightly recessed and have found myself turning the volume up more than I would have previously. I guess the Marantz I had may have been a bit screechy by comparison - plus the sound overall is so lush and inviting now that it just demands to be played loud.

Isaac, Jackthebiscuit and others on here have commented that their NADs hum too, so I don't think there's anything wrong with my unit - plus it had been serviced by Lenbrook while in stumblin's hands and still hummed afterwards. It's just a slightly noisy design - if your put hand on it you can feel it vibrating gently too.

Graham, you're probably right about the bass business for acoustic music - maybe that's why I've never understood the "PRaT" thing... The Marantz 6010KI is a bit idiosyncratic and oddly balanced - it sounds like there's a "hole" in the midbass and can sound a bit thin and flat overall - but it gave loads of detail and pretty well articulated bass through the Quads so that may contribute to my impressions of the NAD.

[sanj]

As for the hum, you could try isolation transformers etc to see if a DC component to the supply is causing a problem, but it could just be the construction of the transformers. .

Graham, could you say more about where u can try out isolation transformers, as I get an intermitent hum on my (unico amp's) toroidal.

ta
sanj

[wadia-miester]

I have 2 suggestions, here mount the transformer on a resin plinth, remove all traces of ferrous metal fixings, Oh and Cryo it. You may be surprised at the results :)

[I-S]

The S300 does hum at a noticeable level. Just the way it is. Probably not helped by having two transformers, which may incite some sort of resonance in one another.

I wouldn't say the top end was muted on mine, but more mid-range prescence would be nice.

[PeteH]

Oh and Cryo it. You may be surprised at the results :)

:lol: ;)

[rewster]

? 3 days in, and you want to change the amp? Did you listen before you bought this amp Pete H?

[PeteH]

? 3 days in, and you want to change the amp? Did you listen before you bought this amp Pete H?

Where did I say I want to change the amp?! :confused:

And no, I didn't listen before I bought it - I couldn't get to the seller (it was picked up by a third party), and I didn't want to waste a dealer's time. If I wanted to change it I could sell it on, but I actually really like it :)

[rewster]

Pete H,

Thank God for that, I thought I felt a disturbance in the force and a hint of indecision creeping in! What with the buzzing transformer and the slight reccession on the go it appeared to be adding up badly. I have only owned one bit of NAD kit, but thought it really good value for money, and was a little surprised to find the amp was not obviously of the 'instantly chuffed' type review.

[I-S]

The S300 isn't an "instantly chuffed" bit of kit. It's one of those ones that takes a little settling with, but you'd miss it when it was gone.

[PeteH]

Pete H,

Thank God for that, I thought I felt a disturbance in the force and a hint of indecision creeping in! What with the buzzing transformer and the slight reccession on the go it appeared to be adding up badly. I have only owned one bit of NAD kit, but thought it really good value for money, and was a little surprised to find the amp was not obviously of the 'instantly chuffed' type review.

Sorry, I guess I'm just not naturally effusive :) . It seems a bit more laid back than the Marantz I had before, that's all, but in a good way - with loads more air and space and naturalness. The hum's only a little annoying because at the moment I keep straining and wondering if I can hear it - not because I actually can hear it, if you see what I mean. Realistically it's not a problem if I just stop worrying about it - and the system does sound pretty damn fantastic to me now FWIW.

I was never all that excited by the Classic Series NAD amps, though they're nice enough - friends of mine have a C320 and a C370 - but the S300 is a completely different beast altogether. And to be honest, ever since I clapped eyes on a picture of them about three years ago I've been irrationally obsessed with owning an S500 / S300 combination - it's nice when things work out. :D

[rewster]

I can see some Neat's or FB1's hoving into view next!

[PeteH]

I can see some Neat's or FB1's hoving into view next!

Get behind me!!! I've taken enough abuse at home over the amount I've spent over the last six months getting this lot together - that's it until at least 2006. :p

FB1s were one of my original speaker targets but to be honest I fell in love with the Quads when I heard them - and I don't think I'm missing all that much in terms of deep bass at least (Paul Messenger or whoever it was at HFC this month measured the 22Ls in their room at -6dB @ 25Hz :cool: ). And to be honest I always take the view that if you're doing an upgrade, you may as well do an upgrade - the next time I buy speakers is when I've got £2k to spend on them. At least. :D

[rewster]

Bart,

It takes a bit to admit you got it wrong sometimes, though it's certainly the way to go if you are to get the best system you can afford. That's where the local dealer comes in, he makes allowances for lend/return, and knows you end up with the right kit in the end.

[rewster]

Pete H,
And therein lies the beauty of not being a lottery millionaire, if you had all that cash you'd be rushing around buying kit like Elton J one day, and bored to bit's the next. Long live the desire to upgrade, keeps it all in focus!
(I assume in making this post you are neither a 1. Lottery Millionaire. 2. Elton John)

[PeteH]

Long live the desire to upgrade, keeps it all in focus!


Actually I think I'm past that for this week at least, and hopefully for considerably longer than that - it really is sounding terrific now. Time to relax and enjoy the music methinks...

[stumblin]

Glad you're enjoying the S300 Pete. If you are anything like me you won't be upgrading for quite some time now.

Btw the remote and power cable are in the post - should be with you tomorrow.

[bottleneck]

Pete

Are you running the power amp from a 4 way multigang along with the rest of your kit?

Sometimes just running an extension socket from another plug just for the amp will reduce/remove hums. You could be experiencing an earthloop.

Chris

[PeteH]

Cheers stumblin - I'll keep an eye out for it.


Are you running the power amp from a 4 way multigang along with the rest of your kit?


The amp's plugged straight into the wall via a kettle lead. I have got a RA Yello (the guy who sold me the S500 had lost the stock lead :D ) - tell you what, I'll try swapping the kettle lead onto the CDP and the Yello onto the amp and report back what happens. If I can be bothered to crawl in amongst all the plastic spaghetti again that is :rolleyes:

[I-S]

Hold on, I think things are getting cross-purpose here. Earthloops will create hum audible through the speakers. The S300 hum is mechanical, from the transformers, although if you wind the volume control to the top and put your ear to the cone, you can hear some 100Hz sawtooth, but 50Hz doesn't really feature.

[PeteH]

That's sort of what I figured, Isaac, although my electrical knowledge is basically zero so I wouldn't have used the big words :D

[michaelab]

The S300 hums - it's just one of it's characteristics. No amount of isolation trannies or any other voodoo will cure it. Still an excellent amp though :)

Michael.

[Gustavo]

Pete, I think that the little laid back highs are not S300 fault, in my opinion the S500 is the main reason.

I had the same kit as you, S300 and S500i and I feel the same experience with the sound as you posted before. My S500i replaced my already sold Creek CD53, and the overall balance of sound was very different as the sound with the nad. Using the creek the sound turns brilliant and some times metallic, mids were not as present as s500, and there was not low at all. Creek CD53 and NAD S300 is not a good match. This is the reason I think that the S300 is very source dependable and use to show everything, without a noticeable coloration, at least to my hears.

A photo of my actual kit with the most recent addition, a tweaked Philips 963 used as a SACD player.

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v325/Gustavov/9632.jpg

All the best.

Gustavo

[davidcotton]

My Marantz 66 KI Signature amp also has an intermittent hum caused by the transformer. Bloody irritating it is too at times. I can guarantee when its about to kick in, as its when the sodding washing machine downstairs kicks into high gear during a spin! It does hum at other times, though not as bad as it did. Its annoying cause aside from that I'm now reasonably happy with the sound from the system. Sure I could spend some £££'s but in the context of my room there probably wouldn't be a lot of point.

Congratulations on the Nad btw.